RADBMX.CO.UK
Technical & Reference Section => Tech and Restoration => Topic started by: dwain dibbly on February 23, 2007, 10:45 AM
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does anyone know much about them?
ive only seen a few pics on bmxmuseum.com
when were they produced? were they a prototype or
were they a full run?
and most importantly
ANY FOR SALE ANYWHERE!!!!!!!! :smitten: :smitten: :smitten:
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Hi Fella, SE Racing never actual made a quadangle cruiser. As you say there are a few about, these where made by other companies as limited runs. Think there have 2 different companies/version (1 of which is called the Quadzilla)
Stunning looks bikes though regardless off who made them. Probaly best to Contact Dingo from here as he had 1 before it went to Mark 'SID' Sailsbury
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Be very careful buying one of these!
Supercross - made a few of these - They are great - but I believe (not sure?) that on some models the geometry of the bb height was badly designed and you will have to use shorter cranks than you might want to.
There is also US seller that makes these and as beautiful as they are, you are likely to lose your money - his name is jesse vargus. (last time I noticed he went by the name gostgun, but has several different names on ebay - you are 95% likely to lose all your money to this man!
If your looking to buy one - check first with people here and in the US that you are buying from a reputable seller.
Losing $500 + dollars isn't funny, but the frames do look great!
Dingo should be able to tell you more about the geometry and ride of these, as he used to own one and swears by them!
Good luck
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Check out the Jonny Chopper Oddangle version. This guy gets a lot of stick on vbmx and os becuase he has made copy parts and not marked them up as such in the past etc, but with a bike that was never built by SE then there can be no confusion.
Sure looks sweet.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Old-School-BMX-Johnny-Chopper-Oddangle-26-Frame-Fork_W0QQitemZ120090508843QQihZ002QQcategoryZ22677QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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I do like Johnny's Odd-angle, they're sweet looking bikes and if I hadn't just comitted to 2 reasonably big purchases, I'd snap one up.
A lot of grief could have been saved by just stamping the bars and forks somewhere though - easy ???
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I've bought tyres from Johnny Chopper in the past and he was good as gold to deal with.
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A lot of grief could have been saved by just stamping the bars and forks somewhere though - easy
they are phil ;).
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I thought he didn't stamp the Skyway bars because thy were made from a different material? ???
Also thought he didn't stamp the bottema forks? ???
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the bars are stamped right on the ends.
i got a couple of sets off him.
the forks are on the steerer tube i think.
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Don't know what all the fuss was about then if he's stamped them? Or did the ho-ha make him stamp them?
Anyway, glad to hear they're stamped.
And just to add, I have dealt with him - a long time ago and a couple of deals. I thought he was a great guy to deal with then :daumenhoch:
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phil i think all the aggro is because he has stamped them in unoticable locations...ends of bars and steerer tubes etc, so in effect so unknowing customer could buy a built up bike and not know theyve bought a copy.....shame cos it looks quality stuff.....
i believe being an aussie that coastal knows this johnny chopper dude
Dave
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That johhny choper dude aint talented as fabricator if he was he would design his own stuff and not copy cat,as a matter of fact when OM scott needed money for you know what he put the blue prints on ebay ,johnny and his convict buds bought them and copied the quad to a T, this is wrong cause people are getting cought out buy them ,NOT ON ,the same with the bottema forks shit,soft parts ,pads etc,decals but this stuff NO >:(
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mark....im with you on the soft goods, and decals etc, and not hardware thing...but in all reality, what is the difference....its all fake
Dave
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Dave you have a point it is all fake ,but atleast the usualy go on a real bike
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Unfortunately, you can't stop people from making this stuff - as much as you (and me) disagree with it.
At least he is stamping them and he's telling people where they're stamped - what more can you ask? ???
I don't think people can be getting caught out by the odd-angle, but maybe the skyway bars and the bottemas. I think JC must have been 'bullied' into stamping the Skyway bars, because I'm sure initially, they weren't stamped :-\
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Unfortunately, you can't stop people from making this stuff - as much as you (and me) disagree with it.
At least he is stamping them and he's telling people where they're stamped - what more can you ask? ???
I don't think people can be getting caught out by the odd-angle, but maybe the skyway bars and the bottemas. I think JC must have been 'bullied' into stamping the Skyway bars, because I'm sure initially, they weren't stamped :-\
Moose, you are right he can't win whatever he does. If my memory serves me right, he originally only made the bars for himself and a couple of mates and then he started to get heaps of enquiries so started making them to order. Maybe he was "bullied" into stamping them and maybe not ( I think he was caught out by the demand and just didn't think about that side of it), but at least he has done the right thing and started to stamp them which is more than what WIN and others did/do with their CW type bars and people are still getting caught out by those all these years later ;) . Also, he doesn't advertise them as originals, he states they are copies and he also makes the forks to fit new school rides, how cool is that then to give your new school ride the old school look?
JC was also a former Factory Skyway rider and a pretty rad one too from what I have read :daumenhoch:
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there are several types of Quad cruiser:-
Supercross made "Quadzilla" (I am actually responsible for that name, how cool? 8) ) also known as "Quad Flyer".
Made by Bill at Supercross to the same dimensions and geometry as the OM Flyer, I owned one, it came through damaged which sort of jaded it for me and I sold it soon after
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/y79/dingobmxer/26quad_dingobmxer.jpg)
also made by Supercross are the "Skunk Quads" which were 24" versions but had problems with back brake/drop out positions and also the BB was too low and you could rest the the bike on the pedals without tipping it over too much so are no good for racing as the pedals catch in berms.
Supercross again did a 24/26 hybrid which I dont know so much about.
lastly there is VRP, Jesse Vargas run company which makes 2 versions, "Big Tube" which is essentially a 24" late 90's Alloy Quad and a "twin tube" which is a hybrid design, amazing bikes, one of the best I have owned but just too big for me to race with 22"+ top tube
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/y79/dingobmxer/quad002.jpg)
fabricated by Sal who did the work for SE in the late 90's and therefore the closest you will get to a "real" SE 24" Quad,he also made 26" ones and 26" Flovals
Johnny Chopper makes 24" Quads in cro mo to the same geometry as late 90's Flovals and 26" ones to the same geo as OM flyers, you can choose between 1" threaded headtubes and caliper brakes or 1&1/8th with v brake mounts,
Hope this clears things up a little?
:) DINGO :)
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ahhh.
i wouldnt care.
the way things are going, you get 20 seconds of recognition for yet another build.
is that really worth the 2000 pounds that you spend?
very few people scrutinise the parts that matter i have found, and have been dissapointed when whoever didnt spot whatever.
id pay reasonable bucks for a copy of the part that was indistiguishable from the original.
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i got no qualms with johnnys work
infact i still want some bottema,s
and dont give 2 fux ,if they are vintage or not
rock on johhny :coolsmiley:
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I have some GENIUNE Bottema rub ons here :coolsmiley:
I fancy some JC Bottema's too if anyone wants to share postage costs??
:) DINGO :)
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well im up for it :daumenhoch:
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cool,
we can have a chat on Sunday then
:) DINGO :)
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ace :daumenhoch:
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I agree good luck to him with his work. He's treated a bit like Biagio over the pond and that it seems the guys can't do good no matter what they do. Biagio spent a fair few quid going to the trouble of reproducing the 400 series spindles, bearings and equally rare lock nuts etc, if the originals didn't break as often as they apparantly did then there would be no need for the repro's!
I for one am glad he made them and afterall when a spindle is fitted there ain't much showing
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wasnt the skyway bars made from stainless too which would distinguish them from the originals anyway....
Dave
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wasnt the skyway bars made from stainless too which would distinguish them from the originals anyway....
Dave
Yep, Dave I think you are right :daumenhoch:
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I think all his bars are stainless, Kos bars too
:) DINGO :)
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Some of the people who have been about for a while may remember 'Sanderspeeds'
Remember the big kick off about them?
This is where the whole 'fake' issue started.
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yeah i do, what a farce.
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Some of the people who have been about for a while may remember 'Sanderspeeds'
Remember the big kick off about them?
This is where the whole 'fake' issue started.
Didn't he try to pass them off as NOS Hutch though? Even had the H logo on them :-\
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this is the whole point you cant be safe to buy a set of hutch cranks now,or bottemas or a quad that is the whole point in why it is wrong,im not saying johhny c doestnt mark them im onabout 12 months down the line when you spend your hard earned cash on somthing advertised as real is a FAKE :tickedoff:
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Copying was more than common in the 80's
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it may have been but you paid less money in the shops for the parts, there was no ebay then
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and the point there is?
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It happens in all collectible hobbys , part of the atttraction for a lot of new collectors is the instant availibility of repops ( i just love that word)
I mean imagine trying to build a old VW without using reproduction parts
So the Issue is that without specialist knowledge you may get done over buying repops, the same unfortunetly in all walks of life . Diamonds , car parts etc etc
If someone is goiing to pay 1000s for welded bits of metal,some one who can weld is eventually going to repop it
so the only constructive way to assist is to compile the differences and give heads up if you spot them
JC stuff is easy to tell the diff its a repop not a counterfiet
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i couldnt build my van without re pops.
i like that word too.
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i like fizzy pops better.
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I for one dont like the word as it is so VBMX, and lets face it......
anyway,
Rich says
I mean imagine trying to build a old VW without using reproduction parts
the point is, people dont care and they dont try, the person driving the VZ is happy to know he is driving a sweet OS car. and HE personally is happy, is that not what matters?
Why do peopl always take this hobby back to the financial side of it? just do as the Dubbers do and 'Run What You Brung'
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amen brother.
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I guess it horses for courses
i dont have anything but sticker sets repoped ( even better as a verb)
but would buy a repoped frame ,if I fancled riding it like a 24 Quad for example , If frames became massivly repoped then i would hope i knew the difference
If i didnt then i would hope to get clued up by doing my homeworkand asking questions on here, But i cetainly do agree that any repoped part should be marked as such or clearly Id'd as to be easily spotable
you are never going to stop it
and in my opinion many things have been copied and sold for original and no one has a bloody clue as they are so good
I guess it does make the original parts even more desirable and with the network of members on here the knowledge is availiable to spot them
Rich
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Reproduction stuff is here and there's nothing we're going to do about it other than we spread the word, that's it, so that when this stuff is being sold as original we put bidders right. As much as we've all tried to put up a united front against it, we have not and will not stop it.
Threads like this are fine by me and whatever your opinion, they come up regularly enough so that any new members can see them and they will soon become aware of what fake stuff is out there.
Bren's idea of a fake library was a good one that we all should have taken up, i mean us, V and os. It's something we could all work together at but it'll take some one person that has time to put in the hours to make it work and Bren's fooked off so it won't be him i guess.
So till then we'll just have to keep reminding us with threads like this one. :coolsmiley:
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ahhh.
i wouldnt care.
the way things are going, you get 20 seconds of recognition for yet another build.
is that really worth the 2000 pounds that you spend?
very few people scrutinise the parts that matter i have found, and have been dissapointed when whoever didnt spot whatever.
id pay reasonable bucks for a copy of the part that was indistiguishable from the original.
THE WHOLE POINT IN A NUTSHELL A REASNOBLE PRICE , THE PROBLEM IS THAT THESE GUYS CAN GET IT SO SPOT ON THAT YOU CANT BUY IT FROM A PICTURE,EXAMPLE.,I WANT A SET OF AEROSPEEDS REAL AEROSPEEDS I SEE SOME COME UP ON EBAY IN USA I CANT BID ON THEM BECAUSE OF THE SANDERSPEED INCIDENT ,I HAVE TO SEE THEM CLOSE UP,THIS IS A PROBLEM,THE SAME WILL HAPPEN WITH THE BOTTEMAS THE ONLY WAY TO TELL THE DIFFERENCE AT THE MOMENT IS THE WELDING I BELIEVE IT HAS A LONGER RUN, SOMBODY COULD EASLY GRIND IT OFF, FLAP IT AND YOU WOULD NOT TELL THE DIFFERENCE BUT THEY WOULD NOT SELL IT FOR WHAY THEY PAID OFF JC THEY WOULD MAKE A LOT OF MONEY THIS IS THE PROBLEM, NOT THE ORIGINAL SELLER BUT THE MIDDLE MAN,IT IS A PROBLEM
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i do be liking that 24" quad, are they A head or threaded
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i do be liking that 24" quad, are they A head or threaded
The VRP Pete? its ahead mate,
also check out JC's version
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=002&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=120073995351&rd=1&rd=1
:) DINGO :)
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be liking the jc version
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nice arent they?
He does 24" or 26" and ahed/v mounts or 1" caliper brake too :daumenhoch:
:) DINGO :)
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:smitten: that would make a great cool comuter bmx :daumenhoch:
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calipers as well, best go and pm him i think
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How can you argue with this?
I've been in this argument for quite a while now. I've copped a lot of crap (and still do, check the new thread on OS)
The forks are stamped and always have been. If anyones worried about resales, ask the seller for good clear closeup shots of the steerer tube.
All the bars are SS as JC has a boat parts business. The funny part is all the cro mo used in the forks is from the US.
The new shool forks are no probs. As Bottemas stopped being made around 83 I think.
Lots of US guys have bought the forks and not just nobodys. Very high profile guys like them. It's the collectors that don't like them. I can understand their points. Most of these forks are used on riders or racers. My original skatepark forks still have the rusty bits on them and thats the way they'll stay. You wont see Skatepark models from Australia, I have the only set ;D
I still haven't used my set of JC's (stamped 004) I'll vacuum seal them and reap the rewards in 20 years :LolLolLolLol:
This is another mate, Petes daily rider.
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/y131/AussieRampar/quad1ii.jpg)
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(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/v108/coastvl/bike%20bits/2006-07-06010.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/v108/coastvl/bike%20bits/2006-07-06005.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/v108/coastvl/bike%20bits/2006-07-06002.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/v108/coastvl/bike%20bits/2006-07-06008.jpg)
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all well and good why does he have to put bottema stickers on forks that clearly are not?????/ and se stickers on a odd angle im sure he can desighn his own decals???????????????????? or is it to individual for his artistic flare and craftmanship,bollocks to JC
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I think the decals, althought the same design as SE Racing, actually say JC Racing - don't they? ???
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I think so. I haven't actually seen the frame close up. I told JC I'm staying out of this one. I've done my bit for the forks. :10_2_12:
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all well and good why does he have to put bottema stickers on forks that clearly are not?????/ and se stickers on a odd angle im sure he can desighn his own decals???????????????????? or is it to individual for his artistic flare and craftmanship,bollocks to JC
He does have his own stickers. You can buy repro bottema stickers from bmxmuseum. I have sets in every color.
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thats cool then if he has his own stickers,i know about the museum ,they are repoos but under licence i bought my ghp ones from gary there :daumenhoch:
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(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/v108/coastvl/bike%20bits/JCsticker0001.jpg)
:daumenhoch:
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I forgot to mention, all the forks are sold raw. It's up to the customer to finish them however they need them.
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Check this. My mate was about to buy a JC quad f&f off the bay when he got this new school one as a complete bike for the same price!
http://cgi.ebay.com/24-Quad-old-school-new-school-cruiser-AWSEOME_W0QQitemZ270102445820QQcategoryZ64644QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
According to the seller... This is what SE should have made but never did. It is a HAND MADE frame (Made by Sal the welder, the same guy who made all the real SE frames back in the day) completely built with all of the best old school and new school parts. You will never see another 24" bike this nice again! There were only 4 or 5 of these frames built.It was built with top notch components such as Kashimax seat, GT post, Hershey clamp, FIT stem, King headset, Landing Gear forks, GT bars, AME grips, AC brakes, Shimano DX lever, Terrycable brake cable, Atom Lab rims, REAL old school Bullseye hubs, (not newer ones with a old school sticker, these are the real deal) Snakebelly up front and a Comp 3 out back, Red Line dual pinch Flight cranks (180mm), Red Line sprocket and DX pedals. Everything was NOS when installed except for the hubs which have new bearings and axles. This bike rides better then ANY other 24" cruiser I have ever ridden. I am 6'3" and it fits me well and handles very nicely on the track. The frame alone cost $1200.00 and I have well over $2000.00 in this bike.
I reckon my mate got a bargain and this is a great looking old school / new school cruiser... what are you guys saying? :-\
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i think you would be so gutted if you got some kos bars, paid top dollar, get em, get your magnet out and nothing, it doesn't stick. :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
the quad is nice and a good idea, build something that doesn't exist, but if the bars and forks are special enough to want to copy then the originals must be worth protecting.
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Check this. My mate was about to buy a JC quad f&f off the bay when he got this new school one as a complete bike for the same price!
http://cgi.ebay.com/24-Quad-old-school-new-school-cruiser-AWSEOME_W0QQitemZ270102445820QQcategoryZ64644QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
According to the seller... This is what SE should have made but never did. It is a HAND MADE frame (Made by Sal the welder, the same guy who made all the real SE frames back in the day) completely built with all of the best old school and new school parts. You will never see another 24" bike this nice again! There were only 4 or 5 of these frames built.It was built with top notch components such as Kashimax seat, GT post, Hershey clamp, FIT stem, King headset, Landing Gear forks, GT bars, AME grips, AC brakes, Shimano DX lever, Terrycable brake cable, Atom Lab rims, REAL old school Bullseye hubs, (not newer ones with a old school sticker, these are the real deal) Snakebelly up front and a Comp 3 out back, Red Line dual pinch Flight cranks (180mm), Red Line sprocket and DX pedals. Everything was NOS when installed except for the hubs which have new bearings and axles. This bike rides better then ANY other 24" cruiser I have ever ridden. I am 6'3" and it fits me well and handles very nicely on the track. The frame alone cost $1200.00 and I have well over $2000.00 in this bike.
I reckon my mate got a bargain and this is a great looking old school / new school cruiser... what are you guys saying? :-\
Thats a VRP and very nice it is too :smitten:
here is my Kappa Quad cruiser for those that missed it :LolLolLolLol:
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/y79/dingobmxer/quad24006.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/y79/dingobmxer/quad24003.jpg)
:) DINGO :)