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Technical & Reference Section => Tech and Restoration => Topic started by: oldschoolace on April 04, 2012, 07:57 PM

Title: Brakeless fork mod (final pics 13th)
Post by: oldschoolace on April 04, 2012, 07:57 PM
Having bought myself this for Christmas i soon find myself missing a front brake  :(

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x455/oldschoolace/P1010549.jpg)


I really wanted the forks to match the frame but in their wisdom WTP only did a brakeless fork for this model.
As some of you will recall i mused the idea of mounting removable brake mounts on two seat clamps so i could run a U brake and not have to drill the forks for a weak traditional caliper.

The tapered forks measure 32mm around the area where a brake would sit and after hours of fruitless searching for seat clamps chunky enough to drill and tap for the brake mounts i decided it would be better to make my own  :D

Spent a pleasant afternoon in work not actually working but pissing around with some recycled plastic samples i got sent for a job a while back  ;)

This is the prototype (sorry for the bobbins pics)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x455/oldschoolace/brakemod2.jpg)

and mounted in place on the fork with the brake offered up for fit

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x455/oldschoolace/brakemod1.jpg)


Pretty pleased how it came out. There is plenty of clearance for the tyre and even the plastic prototype gripped well when tightened up  :D

Ordering some T6 aluminium tonight and hoping to get them done next week, stay tuned  ;D

Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: Darren KAP on April 04, 2012, 08:04 PM

    :daumenhoch:   can't beat a head scratching project  :4_17_5:  can't wait to see the finished job  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: Jaymz on April 04, 2012, 09:11 PM
cracking idea, but begs a  question, obviously the plastic is bendy and opened up around the fork to do the single point up at the back, how is this going to translate to metal?
The only way i can see this working is if the clamp is two peices [kinda like the DC clamps] with the mount on one piece with countersunk holes on either side of the mount for the bolt heads to sit in and tapped holes on the other piece on either side
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: bobbbbsy on April 04, 2012, 09:19 PM
cant see it lasting long in plastic or ally ! brake lugs are hardcore for a reason! braze ons ?
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: Dannywhac on April 04, 2012, 09:30 PM
Great idea :) But there's a couple of things - ally won't last too long if you're gonna ride hard, and more importantly you need a bridge that connects the two lug clamps over the wheel otherwise they'll move away from the wheel after a few brakes I reckon.
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 04, 2012, 09:36 PM
cracking idea, but begs a  question, obviously the plastic is bendy and opened up around the fork to do the single point up at the back, how is this going to translate to metal?
The only way i can see this working is if the clamp is two peices [kinda like the DC clamps] with the mount on one piece with countersunk holes on either side of the mount for the bolt heads to sit in and tapped holes on the other piece on either side

 ;D just been having the same discussion with my brother. Yeah if i was looking to make these to sell then that would deffo be the way to go. As it is, with the bolt removed the slot in the back of the clamp slides over the fork dropouts lovely. Didnt have to pry the plastic at all  :daumenhoch:

I concede that over time the aluminium clamp may develop stress fractures but i dont intend to use the front brake all the time, just for the odd endo and stuff. The final design will be a few mili thicker in the thin spots now i know there is definately enough room for it  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 04, 2012, 09:40 PM
Great idea :) But there's a couple of things - ally won't last too long if you're gonna ride hard, and more importantly you need a bridge that connects the two lug clamps over the wheel otherwise they'll move away from the wheel after a few brakes I reckon.

Valid point about the bridge. I did think of that but i dont want the hole thing to be too bulky. It may well need it anyway but its work in progress at the moment so will get it done and road test it  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: pickle on April 05, 2012, 07:41 AM
or drill the forks and use a plate  ???
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 10:49 AM
Very nearly went down the road of drilling and u brake plate but couldnt bring myself to drill a hole in my lovely new forks  :smitten:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: ozone on April 05, 2012, 10:57 AM
couldnt bring myself to drill a hole in my lovely new forks  :smitten:

Fitting your clamps to fork legs will probably damage the paint (at the very least) anyway so I'd be thinking about.

A - getting another fork which is already drilled and colour matching them to the frame.
B - buying a cheap bike with front and rear brakes to thrash around and leaving your lovely bike well alone. 
C - talking to Kappy about a front disc conversion.   :LolLolLolLol: 
D - what pickle said....

Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 11:08 AM
Well im doing it anyway  :yahoo_silent:   :2funny:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: pickle on April 05, 2012, 11:18 AM
If you're going to go to all that trouble the least you  ;)could do is pull your bars back a bit
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: Dannywhac on April 05, 2012, 11:30 AM
If you're going to go to all that trouble the least you  ;)could do is pull your bars back a bit

 ;D

I love the idea of doing this (and yes there are easier ways as said, getting drilled forks etc), but it smacks of a good bit of mid-school make do and mend, if not invent :) So I'm in  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: Mdbh on April 05, 2012, 11:42 AM
If I was you I'd stop the messing around and weld some lugs on, then colour match the paint! Sorted! :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: lk_97 on April 05, 2012, 11:48 AM
I have some affix forks with lugs? :LolLolLolLol: :LolLolLolLol:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 11:52 AM
(http://www.canootervalve.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/The-Dude.jpg)



 :LolLolLolLol:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: ozone on April 05, 2012, 12:04 PM
(http://www.canootervalve.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/The-Dude.jpg)



 :LolLolLolLol:

You have no frame of reference.  You are out of your element.   :2funny:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: lk_97 on April 05, 2012, 12:26 PM
I was joking, by the way :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 01:31 PM
I was joking, by the way :daumenhoch:

 ;) yeah me too with the dude reference  :daumenhoch:  ;D
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: dan-dare on April 05, 2012, 08:19 PM
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PACE-Alloy-V-Brake-mounts-RC31-Carbon-Rigid-Forks-Good-Condition-RARE-xtr-/320878818997?pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item4ab5de36b5

dunno what diameter your forks are....  :daumenhoch: :daumenhoch: :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 08:33 PM
V brakes...  :shocked: how very dare you sir!!!  :LolLolLolLol:

Cheers for that bud  :daumenhoch: My forks are 32mm though  :(

Could pad it out with a rubber gasket, which would also protect the paint on the forks but i cant run V brakes... Hate the things  :2funny:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: lk_97 on April 05, 2012, 08:36 PM
Would you be able to make me a set of brake mounts like that? Need some for my frame as it only has chainstay mounts :-\ of course, I'll pay :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: dan-dare on April 05, 2012, 08:41 PM
V brakes...  :shocked: how very dare you sir!!!  :LolLolLolLol:

mount them higher up the leg for AD brakes.... :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 08:52 PM
In all seriousness i did think about that as there is only 0.1mm difference in the mount diameter if memory serves. I think i concluded, wrongly or rightly, that as the v mounts sit 4mm or so closer to the rim it may make installing a u brake a touch tight  :-\
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: pickle on April 05, 2012, 09:02 PM
Just buy some new forks and get Dan to colour match the frame :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 05, 2012, 09:06 PM
Just buy some new forks and get Dan to colour match the frame :daumenhoch:

I see your point  :daumenhoch: but where's the fun in that  :LolLolLolLol:

Anyway, fookin about with this gives me an almost valid excuse for not getting on with work  :LolLolLolLol:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: pickle on April 06, 2012, 08:19 AM
The 'fun' as you say will probably end in 2 ways, 1 you make your very nice looking WTP bike look shyte.......and 2 you pull the brake to do an endo, the whole lot fails ending in you hurting yourself and your nice blue forks completely fooked.

Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 06, 2012, 02:04 PM
Thanks for all the comments guys.  :daumenhoch: I share you concerns, hence the thread, but if i dont try we will never know  :D  ;D 
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 12, 2012, 06:59 PM
Fooking well pleased with myself today.  :4_17_5:


(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x455/oldschoolace/P1010090.jpg)

I cut the large hole with a woodworking spade bit  :shocked:
Took a good 15 minutes for each hole but was bob on when done  :smitten:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: dp and Chopper Dude on April 12, 2012, 10:21 PM
You can't beat a bit of home brew engineering.
Daft question, are you going to do anything to stop them from spinning round under braking after a while?
Well apart from making sure they are nice & tight. What about attaching some kind of horse shoe shaped plate at the rear of the forks attaching them together? Obviously it's your modification and your bike, just an idea to throw into the pot.
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: Betty on April 12, 2012, 10:31 PM
Might be a dumb question but how will they fit on the forks?  ???
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 12, 2012, 10:51 PM
Might be a dumb question but how will they fit on the forks?  ???

Work in progress at the moment. I will cut a slot to form the clamp which will slide over the dropouts (outer left and right sides as you look at it) and the hole you can see inside the large hole will be widened and tapped to accept a screw in 990 post.

dp dude, i may well have to add a brace at some point but at the moment im hoping a collar made from a racer inner tube will give me both extra grip and also protect the paintwork to a degree  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: bobbbbsy on April 12, 2012, 10:56 PM
i saw something like this for sale from a legit company but i pasted the link n forgot about it.. seems it works with good strong alloy !  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 12, 2012, 11:00 PM
Nice one. This is T6 ali so im hoping it will do the job  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: bobbbbsy on April 12, 2012, 11:02 PM
they were square with the corner chopped off and were 2 piece that bolted together like a big old skool dc double clamp sorta !
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: pickle on April 13, 2012, 11:22 AM
I reckon these would help
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/haro-freestyle-threadless-tapered-bmx-forks-1-18-brake-mounts-/270938239793?pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item3f152d7331

followed by a trip to
http://www.pwsfinishing.co.uk/contactus.html

job done  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: SaMAlex on April 13, 2012, 11:28 AM
im hoping a collar made from a racer inner tube will give me both extra grip and also protect the paintwork to a degree  :daumenhoch:


990s are pretty powerfull brakes. Powerful enough to snap off welded on lugs, and to flex frames out when you pull them. I'd be pretty sure the bolt on mounts will slide round eventually. As said before; best solution is a front fitting brace bar (like a horse shoe). That should solve it.  :daumenhoch:
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: dp and Chopper Dude on April 13, 2012, 01:54 PM
I've just spotted theseon another thread. What about something like that? :
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/ab312/kungfuracer/Falcon%20Pro%20Aero%20Flyer/Photo0933.jpg)
I forgot all about them! They should help if the mounts ever moved. Less work than knocking up a brace & it keeps things looking cleaner (possibly)
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: oldschoolace on April 13, 2012, 04:06 PM
All done  :daumenhoch: Just need to screw the 990 mounts in and give em a whirl.
Went for a brushed finish rather than polished as i think it will suit the bike better  :)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x455/oldschoolace/mod1.jpg)


(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x455/oldschoolace/mod2.jpg)
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod
Post by: bobbbbsy on April 15, 2012, 05:14 PM
I've just spotted theseon another thread. What about something like that? :
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/ab312/kungfuracer/Falcon%20Pro%20Aero%20Flyer/Photo0933.jpg)
I forgot all about them! They should help if the mounts ever moved. Less work than knocking up a brace & it keeps things looking cleaner (possibly)

is that what them bloody things are for , i forgot. i keep finding them in my parts bucket !! gonna use some ! lol

here are some i found dude !!

http://www.tredz.co.uk/.Identiti-Rebate-Rim-Brake-Adaptor_43426.htm
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod (final pics 13th)
Post by: Munnyella on April 18, 2012, 08:28 AM
Look good, hope they work ok, now sink them allen bolt heads you lazy bu66er!!

MM
Title: Re: Brakeless fork mod (final pics 13th)
Post by: oldschoolace on April 18, 2012, 03:03 PM
Look good, hope they work ok, now sink them allen bolt heads you lazy bu66er!!

MM

 :2funny: Strangely enough not long after i posted them last pics i though, bollocks i forgot to sink those bolt heads!
10 mins on the pillar drill and all is sorted now  :daumenhoch:

Tried them on sunday with a little collar of old inner tube as a gasket. Perfect fit! Going to try a full brake rig on them this weekend or for blackpool if i get chance.
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