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New School BMX 2004 - Now => New School Park, Street & Dirt => Topic started by: BENDYCAT ELEVENTEEN on February 08, 2012, 12:20 PM
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Right starting to build it back up again after the star washer was replaced
so bottom bearing in right way around
top bearing in and right way around
the the little split ring
then the top washer
so you then have about a 1" of fork tube showing
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11144.jpg)
so cos it's been running a twin cable pull, it's got a gyro - saterlite and a fly tab and cable holder
now if you put the stem on with out the fly cable holder you have about 3 mm and this is where the top hat fits
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11148.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11149.jpg)
but if you put the holder on - you have about 1/2"
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11145.jpg)
now put the stem on as well and you have less than 1/2" to put the stem on and lock down - also the top hat washer doesn't do up now ??? ::) can't reach
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11146.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11147.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11150.jpg)
this is just DOING MY FOOKING HEAD IN :tickedoff: :uglystupid2: :2gunsfiring_v1:
So how the hel did it run before with brake set up - some one who knew bmx in a shop had to of put it on ? ???
am i missing some thing and will feel the fool :crazy2: :uglystupid2:
surely you can't run it on 1/2" hold and feel safe ? ???
did the shop sell em some thing that didn't work and bodged it :crazy2:
i just wanted to set it up and dial it in, but it's just winding me up :tickedoff:
please help :'(
cheers B :(
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Might explain why the old nut had broken?
Looks like you have 1 of 2 options.
1. Ditch the gyro and go single cable
2. Ditch your stem and cable hanger and buy a fly stem or s&m stem which have the cable hanger tabs built into the sides
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As pickle says might explain why the star fangled washer broke in the first place
I would suggest getting something like this, if you want to run it the way it is. That way it can't come off when riding
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx'modelID=48381 (http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx'modelID=48381)
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So how the hell has it been running so high when the original guy put it on ?
I am surprised jim didn't go ass over tit and the stem come off when he test rode it
right have a look at the you -tube clip and see that the guy had to cut down the holder - an option ?
so the stem it needs to cover the the fork tube right and i'm not going mad
i take it a single brake cable will work just as well ?
would have liked to keep the gyro just to learn bar spins
feck it ::)
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As pickle says might explain why the star fangled washer broke in the first place
I would suggest getting something like this, if you want to run it the way it is. That way it can't come off when riding
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx'modelID=48381 (http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx'modelID=48381)
still don't feel safe with only 1/2" hold of the stem to fork tube
gyro plate needs to be shorter to fit and be sake to hold on
is there any thing the i don't have to change my stem or loose the gyro ?
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You definatley have the bottom bearings in right? can't see in any of your pictures but i'm guessing you do.
If so then there's something very wrong with that set up if that's how someone rode it!
Like i said, if you lose the gyro and go single cable then your stem is just right.
If you want to run the gyro then i think you need a new stem with tabs on it
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I would try one of the steel 1"1/8th top gyro plates and a small headset spacer washer first. As that alloy top plate is quite thick. I would have thought I've got a plate some where. I would imagine the bike didn't originally have a gyro and that is why the forks are so short. To stop flexing. Or as others have said fit a stem with gyro tabs already attached. You should be able to find a good one on here or eBay for a few quid. :daumenhoch:
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i'd lose the gyro.
how many times are you gonna spin ya bars that much.
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Please dont run the bike with the stem half on. Not good at all. Its perfect in that pic without the gyro plate. Gyros are over rated anyway! ;D
I'd guess that someone has cut down the fork steer tube. They often need cutting down if you like a low stem. If the old forks do have a shortened steer tube, the Best solution is to get new forks. If your forks have been cut down too much, thats what needs fixing
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I should have boxed it up with stem still intact :(
All seemed ok when it was at mine.
Have u checked pix for how it was stacked?
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That gyro plate does look very thick. It almost looks like it has 2 extra spacers stuck to the bottom of it ???
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Jim if you hadn't of taken it apart - i would be riding it like that and think it's safe - don't want to think what would have happened - so big thanks AGAIN mate :daumenhoch:
right i have a idea and just waiting for photobuck to stop C***ing me about ::) so i can show you lot and see what you think
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I was about to suggest new forks as well but Alex got there first.
I think you could get other gyro plates that are half the thickness of that one and it would be fine
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I have also noticed something else. The gyro plate is machined out to fit under the stem but it doesn't look the same profile as the stem shape. Lifting it up a few more mm. You could have the top plate machined to match your stem on top and have 5mm or so taken off the bottom to give you more room. Actually I have a flat alloy plate that is around 5mm thick that my mate made up for me if the stem will accommodate a 5mm plate. Just take your plate off and fit the stem and leave a 5mm gap. Then you can see if you have enough fork room. I will send it to you if it will work. Just buy me a beer next time you see me. :)
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The gyro plate is machined out to fit under the stem but it doesn't look the same profile as the stem shape.
Oooh!!!!
Is the gyro plate on the right way? The machined part is wedge shaped, same as the stem. It looks like it might be on backwards
The edge of the stem and the gyro plate both have signs of wear, as tho they did fit snug before
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I noticed that as well alex. It could be the wrong profile for the stem. However that will only let it down a mm or so. So that isn't going to make a massive amount of difference. :(
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well that is the thing i was thinking about the plate
right so the gyro plate is 19mm tall and this i think is where it pushes up the stem and then the stem can't lock on to enough tube
tube hasn't been cut down as for as i can see - top is factory finish
so have a look at the pic's and let me know and see if you think it will work
plate is 19mm tall and if i cut the extra bottom off of it to 8mm taking off 10-11mm
on doing this the stem will not lock onto the tube and look safe and the top hat bolt will screw on
will this leave enough room for cables to screw in the top of the plate - enough movement for it to work on pulling the brake - i'm assuming that it can be dialed in so that you can pull the brake lever and have movement in the gyro and then enough squeeze in the calipers (will be the next issue of getting to work )
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11151.jpg)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11152.jpg)
let me know what you think ???
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still looks higher than i would be happy with :-\
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WOW! Thats a thick gyro plate! Most of them dont have those "spacers" built in!
Maybe get thinner gyro plate?
Or can you get rid of the dust cover top cap on the headset, even if its just till you get a thinner gyro plate?
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i'd say ditch the gyro for now and ride it, then long term buy some new forks and set the gyro up :daumenhoch:
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As the others have said, double check the headset's in correctly, get a thinner gyro plate, a fly bikes low rise top cap will also give You more room but You may find You run into the problem of the gyro hits the plate before the blocks hit the rim when You pull the lever. I would think originally the bike came with a normal cable & the steerer just isn't long enough to run a gyro set up.
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A "normal" gyro plate:
http://www.liferbmx.co.uk/store/vocal-alloy-gyro-plate-black-p-5358.html
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Bendy here is a pic of the alloy plate I can send you. It's actually 4mm thick. Let me know as I'm going to the post office in a bit. Yours for the price of a beer when I next see ya! :daumenhoch:
(http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x398/rad-discostu/17be4d9b.jpg)
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how thin does the gyro plate need to be / or is standard ? - that's about 8mm i can get it down to
Rob - you can see the old grease line in side the fork tube to where it would sit with out a gyro/plate - is it really that bad ??? as that is where the new refit would sit now ?
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sorry for delay in answering all - photobucket is slow
just a picture of the top of the plate (yes i know it's backward - it was just a quick shot)
(http://www.radbmx.co.uk/archive/albums/tt183/ELEVENTEENBENDYCAT/stereo%20bmx/SNV11135.jpg)
stu - that could do the trick - let me just see what it looks like that i could get my plate down to - many thanks mate - yes a pint would be yours :daumenhoch: still trying to find out if i can make it to the summer run ::)
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That grease mark is still lower than i would run it to be honest and i'd say definately the reason why the original bolt sheered the nut out of the star nut
if you're itching to ride it, lose the gyro and go single cable :daumenhoch:
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if you're itching to ride it, lose the gyro and go single cable :daumenhoch:
With a single linear cable you can still spin the bars once. Gyros are always a bit of a pain, and added hassle to set up.
Keep it simple for now and upgrade to a gyro later if you want.
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what Alex says :daumenhoch:
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right before i go the pickle route
fork in the road time
any one else have a idea/ see if it can work with a flatter plate ?
if i go single cable / lever - what is good out there - and would it be just a cable /lever and what else for this set up and then is it just cable ties with cable to frame - cable to stradle ?
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Just get a Vocal linear cable, same as the dearer ones but only about a fiver :daumenhoch:
why do you need a new lever? is yours an oddy one which the two cables go into?
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You can't realistically run a gyro with a steerer that short looking at it again :( run a normal cable or get some new forks if You're set on having One, even better get some new forks with brake mounts, Two brakes double the fun! :daumenhoch:
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Bendy - get yourself a traditional top gyro hanger and a selection of loose spacers. Assemble everything and experiment with spacers until you find a happy balance between the amount of clearance the gyro needs to work without hitting the underside of the stem and the amount of stem you have protruding above the steerer. Be aware you MUST have some gap between stem and steerer so you can accurately adjust your headset. I'd say 5mm there or thereabouts.
As others have said, gyros are fussy things to own. But if you're like me and just love the gadget aspect, don't worry, between us all we can get that bike dialled in.
A top load stem & a Vocal stepped gyro plate would sort your gyro clearance issues out without going to the expense of new forks if it continues to be a pain in the arse.
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Sorry Fugazi - didn't mean to fully contradict you there, I was super slow replying and yours went in first...
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ok so just reading all and weigh up every thing
Christ knows how they ran it like this and got away with it :idiot2: and lucky Jim didn't go for a Burton
i can get the gyro down to 5mm - but is it now to far gone with thoughts for this option ?
yes it's the twin barrel lever
so what good and cool in levers - cables - any other bits i need ?
like the look of the eclat lever
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I have never had a problem with a gyro. Once you know how to dial them in they are very easy to fit. And work really well. The top tip is to remove the cables from the bike and squirt as much wd40 down the wire into the plastic sleeve as possible on the sections you can't remove the inner from the outer. And on the lower one remove the bottom outer and squirt it all over the inner and down the outer. Then fit them with the adjusters screwed in. Fit the top first. You want to get the gyro as close to the bottom plate as possible. So it has a greater amount of movement. Adjust the two adjustment screws in the top plate to take out any cable slack. Then hold the gyro and pull the lever. If it hits the bottom of the adjusters in the top plate the adjusters may need to be adjusted some more. But leave that alone until the bottom cable has been fitted as you may have enough travel in the gyro already for the pads to touch the rim.
Then after lubeing the lower cable fit it with the bottom adjuster screws wound in until they just touch the bottom of the gyro. If it has a good amount of travel the gyro will be sitting on the bottom plate and the bottom adjuster screws will be wound out nearly all the way. Then feed your cable into your brake if it's a pitbull for instance and adjust it up so the pads hit the rim when the lever is pulled. Or for a u brake you can adjust it at the centre pull or at the connecting cable between the two arms. You should now have a working gyro and brake. I find it easier to dial in a gyro as it has so many areas that you can adjust to get a good braking system. Saying it is worse than a standard cable and lever is a bit of a myth. Usually started by people that haven't fitted them correctly. And then poo poo'ed them as being crap. It's a shame really. :)
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all info is welcome - it might take me a little time to work things out and understand :crazy2: as i know you lot can see in your how it works but dumb Bendy can't ;D
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A top load stem & a Vocal stepped gyro plate would sort your gyro clearance issues
http://www.liferbmx.co.uk/store/vocal-rise-alloy-gyro-plate-black-p-5366.html
:daumenhoch: :daumenhoch:
yes it's the twin barrel lever
like the look of the eclat lever
You can still run a single cable in the oddy twin cable lever. You might need the ferrel that comes with the lever, but I bet someone has one.
I found the Eclat Levers a bit short
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I find it easier to dial in a gyro as it has so many areas that you can adjust to get a good braking system. Saying it is worse than a standard cable and lever is a bit of a myth. Usually started by people that haven't fitted them correctly. And then poo poo'ed them as being crap. It's a shame really. :)
I think a well set up Gyro DOES work and feel better than a straight cable, but they ARE more hassle to fit, no question.
And lets face it, fitting a clamp on stem isnt that hard, and that's taken 2 pages so far ;) ;D
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Sorry Fugazi - didn't mean to fully contradict you there, I was super slow replying and yours went in first...
Hey no problem Rob, the more advice He can get the better I think :daumenhoch:
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I've got One of those Vocal stepped top plates & the gyro will still hit on the lower part of it, I found it's just better at getting some of the slack out of standard type cables.
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Alex. :LolLolLolLol:
Maybe if we give bendy any more advise it might make 3 pages. And poor bendys brain will burst with all this info.
I bet he wished he'd never asked! :2funny: :daumenhoch:
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two pages and we have only just started ;D
it's not easy when you don't have peeps right next to you and see what you are looking at - explaining it right under you nose and seeing it for real
so if i cut the plate down to 5mm - is it the ammout of distance between the palte and the pull up part that has to be close or further away ~ as in the last plate link put up ?
i do find that the lever on there at the mo is a bit short in arm length - below is the one i have
https://www.customriders.com/prodshow.asp?prodid=7947&cat=27&parent=1001&sid=3
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Anyway bendy if you want that plate. Pm me your address and I will post it to you. I'm going to the post office in the next hour. Cheers stu :daumenhoch:
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Tech 77 lever, they are cheap and just work :daumenhoch:
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:D :crazy2: :uglystupid2: i don't know what i want ???
it's the fork in the road
so thinner plate or not - please all let me know as i don't know weather to change set up of if the old way will work with new plate
i need food as i'm feeling weak now :-[ ;D
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sorry rob not a big fan of the look
had a trigger on a GT and liked the fact that it help with a bit more grip
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Right, let's nail it down.
Oddy Medium lever. Very few people like the small.
Skinnier top plate will allow you to faf around with spacers as I mentioned.
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Put your old gyro plate on with the top cable screwed in place. Fit the cables into the gyro and pull the lever to see how much the gyro travels up. That is the minimum distance you need between the gyro and the top plate. In fact on yours just turn the top plate upside down as that would be roughly the same place as my flat plate would sit. Then pull the brake. If the gyro. When pulled hits the top plate before the brakes hit the rim it is not good. Your next step is to adjust the brake closer to the rim. If you can get the brake to work without the gyro hitting the top plate then you know my flat plate should work. :daumenhoch:
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Oddy Medium lever. Very few people like the small.
Skinnier top plate will allow you to faf around with spacers as I mentioned.
Totally agree that the small oddy lever is crap, and the medium lever is great
Rob, have you looked at how little fork tube there is there? I dont think you'll have room for ANY spacers, even with a thin gyro plate ???
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i'd get the dremmel out or axe saw and saw the bottom off the plate you got till you was happy you had enough space to fit your stem safe.
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so is this to little tube /stem - as running without a gyro will on drop it down about 5mm more ?
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Oddy Medium lever. Very few people like the small.
Skinnier top plate will allow you to faf around with spacers as I mentioned.
Totally agree that the small oddy lever is crap, and the medium lever is great
Rob, have you looked at how little fork tube there is there? I dont think you'll have room for ANY spacers, even with a thin gyro plate ???
I have, but that's such a kooky plate he's got there, I'm punting he could maybe use a regular plate and reduce spacing down by half and that would just about be acceptable. Assuming the brake is dialled in spot on..
Bendy - by ditching the gyro plate you gain that extra bit yeah. You could always drill & tap tabs into the stem.....
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It may fit and work ok. The lower you get the gyro/stem the stronger your ride is. But equaly you need to have enough room between the lower gyro tabs and the upper plate for your gyro to travel up and down enough to operate your brakes. :daumenhoch:
That's why I said to fit your current one upside down and fit the cables and pull the lever. Then you can see if there is enough gyro travel. If the gyro touches the top plate then you may be able to adjust the rear brake closer to the rim. If there isn't enough travel after that then its pretty much game over. Time to fit a single cable system or longer forks. I think you will just about have enough room. :daumenhoch: if the gyro doesn't touch the top plate then my plate will do the job for you. :)
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I honestly don't think you've got enough space to run a plate on that, I'd go for a single cable job if it were mine.
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right just turn the plate up side down and found everything is a little to close - can't get enough lift to pull slack out of cable, and it's adjusted as far as it can go
so looks like it will be a single cable ~ no gyro - cheers to stu but giving up on the plate working :daumenhoch: will get you a half for your troubles
also just looked at the rear brakes and there is not pop back - it's about 1-2mm from the pads to rim and not spring back in place - so will have to adjust them on the new single cable
will put all the gyro stuff to one side - might try again one day, but will see
just want to say a big thank you to all in this thread for helping - team effort in helping out a bro :daumenhoch:
cheers B ;)
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right so now what shall we talk about ;D
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Nevermind bendy. Keep the gyro it may be good for a future build. Putting the plate on upside down was the only way to find out if it was gonna be to close for the gyro to travel. New lever and cable then mate. I would also say that the odyssey mid lever is a good one. With a slick cable. :daumenhoch:
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i'd get a big hammer.
and SMASHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH it right up :LolLolLolLol:
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Put the thinner gyro tab on top of the stem if the cable will reach
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bof - that won't look good :-\
stu - many thanks for the info - that is what decided it >:( ;D :daumenhoch:
dordy - can i try on your stuff first ;D
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i'd get a big hammer.
and SMASHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH it right up :LolLolLolLol:
If in doubt, get the hammer out :daumenhoch:
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http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/380385725443'ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
Get some of those, I have a pair, nice and light too 8)
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the forks on mine are light - if any thing the bars are heavy
but hopefully the ride is now sorted and just needs a brake 8)
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Bendy. Got a thin demolition giro plate in black here with your name on it. Just cover postage mate.
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Have a look on stereo bikes website, all the completes look like they have no spacers so i don't think your steerer has been cut down
Get some new forks, internally threaded, you'll be able to run the gyro with no problems... :daumenhoch:
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yer the top didn't look cut down - think i'm just gonna run a single for the mo - was just hoping to sort it all out with the parts i had on the bike - only took three pages to sort out ;D
cheers Jaymz for the offer mate - stu offered his as well, but check out mine upside down and it just didn't have the clearance - maybe a U type with the life edges may fit but that will be for a different day ;)