MADE IN TAIWAN? but itīs a Hoffman!!!

[skidmark]

So there I was, a teenager with a brand new Big Daddy frame sat inside the box that cost me 320 paper round quids, I canīt wait, I rip it open, whatīs the first thing I see?............."MADE IN TAIWAN".
Come on, who else felt well cheesed off thinking their bike had been hand made right next to that ninja ramp?? I reckon mr Hoffman got off quite lightly with this one.

[scott250]

Me mate had 1, he cracked it in about 5 different places.  Yer, I'd have been pissed paying that much.  I rode a  flash for a year, mostly trails - I think it was made in taiwan,,still was a nice bike to ride.

[HEYWOOD BMX]

  I see your point,reckon things have changed a lot since then.The majority of BMX frames are now made in Taiwan & build quality can be as good if not better than some USA made frames... 

[skidmark]

Well they were still pretty good bikes, I have a  U.S. ramp room Condor and the welding looks like itīs been done by a 5 year old girl so you could argue that the Taiwan quality was better.
Thing is, the move could only have been made to reduce costs but the bikes stayed expensive,  plus me being a dreamy kid at the time(still am),  Hoffman was a bit of an idol I spose so the thought of getting a frame straight out of that ramp room having been breathed on by the man himself meant something!.......am I getting wierd?

[scott250]

Well they were still pretty good bikes, I have a  U.S. ramp room Condor and the welding looks like itīs been done by a 5 year old girl so you could argue that the Taiwan quality was better.
Thing is, the move could only have been made to reduce costs but the bikes stayed expensive,  plus me being a dreamy kid at the time(still am),  Hoffman was a bit of an idol I spose so the thought of getting a frame straight out of that ramp room having been breathed on by the man himself meant something!.......am I getting wierd?

No, thats not wierd - you bought into the hoffman brand from a world no1 ramp rider - much better than buying from some numpty behind a desk just interested in profit only than making a nice bike too.  They all crack after so long, even standards  haha

[dialledbikes]

Wasnt the Hoffman "Egg" given that name because it was bound to crack?

[condor96]

there are so many different points that could be made on this topic. to me, yes it kinda killed it for me when they started making bikes in taiwann,even if they were built a little bit better, plus i didnt like the way the graffics and decals started going. everything turned into an hb star. boring.

but......................
in a way i really dont blame hoffman for the move of production to taiwann.

he had soooo much going on. the biggest name in the sport, running the b.s. series,building bikes,sprocket jockey shows, i could see how he was so over worked with everything.
one of the main reasons why it went to taiwann is he could never keep up with the demand.

when he first came out with bikes they were being made by s.e. - they couldnt keep up with demand.
when he moved production into the ramp room- he had a bit more product,but still couldnt keep up with demand.
when production when to taiwann- he finnally had enough product to keep up with the demand.

when the bikes were made in the ramp room, he didnt really make any money off them. he was barely skiming by,paying his entire team their salory,paying all the workers in the shop,running the sprocket jockey rig and the b.s. series. he couldnt even really pay the workers for their designs, he was broke,one of the reasons he didnt have many ads back then. in 94 he even skipped out on taxes for a few months so he could buy more tubing to make more bikes, technically making them built illeagally (and the i.r.s. showed up demanding to see the company records. hoffman got audited and slapped with a huge fine) but it was either shut down the biz or skip on taxes. hoffman bikes could have ended right there.

[christhejob]

Wasnt the Hoffman "Egg" given that name because it was bound to crack?

yes indeed they did, and they did indeed!

[skidmark]

Good points made there Condor96.  I spose it was a necessary progression.....just wish heīd waited till I got my bike before doing it!!
I do feel they lost their appeal somehow, at least for me.
Good one Mike, I heard they call Hoffman the "condor" cos he once layed an egg and those bikes were yoke-filled with a bit of white which rusted them from the inside.

[gary4130]

never had a prob with my tai big daddys even in the '90s -only rode flat then +now .the tai frames always look better finished off .

didn't se make the first big daddys with a mild steel headtube 'that would have been a big problem for heavy riding.you've got to give hoffman credit for everything he was doing at the time   

[condor96]

didn't se make the first big daddys with a mild steel headtube 'that would have been a big problem for heavy riding.

i highly, highly doubt it. with how fanatical hoffman was with his top spec bikes, he never would have allowed it.  the only fault (and thats a loose term) i could even think of for the s.e. made big daddies is the 3/16th rear dropouts. but thats just nitpicking, they were soon changed out to 1/4 when production moved in house.

speaking of which, id love to come across an s.e. big daddy.  i know of only one still existing.....

[skidmark]

o.k., I think itīs clear that the quality of the Taiwan bikes was excellent and arguably better than the U.S. ones, but I ask the question.....why are the new reproduction Haro, S.E. and Raleigh bikes less desireable than an old bashed up frame which someone dragged out of a skip? 
Because they have a story to tell!, they werenīt just made by some guy in Taiwan who thinks heīs making the legs for 60.000 coffee tables.

You can look at it from a functional point of view and say it doesnīt matter, fair enough.  There are people though who see more than that.

I mean no disrespect to the Hoff, thereīs no doubt he is a legend who has done lot for bmxing and inspired people to pick up a 20" kids bike again....this is why I wanted a bike from his ramp room and not Taiwan!!.

Yeh Condor96, an S.E. big daddy would be some find, I guess a lot ended up with mangled dropouts and chucked in a bush somewhere .

[TwoBobRob]

Skid, thats a good point mate.  I've had an SE Condor and a RampRoom Condor.  The SE got traded away back in 95 while I waited for my new one to arrive. But now, whilst I'm not a collector or restorer or owt, there is no way that my RR Condor will ever leave my possession.  Like you say, it has stories to tell 

Some people would argue that Hoffmans move to Taiwan pretty much paved the way for the industry we see now. There was no way the other rider owned companies were going to Tai, considering the reputation of Tai bikes at that time. His decision to progress and improve things definately made people think it was ok again to buy a Tai bike.