What is a mongoose 2 / there's no such thing as a motomag model....let's discuss

[Redline]

I can see this thread ending up like the infamous Redline Proline thread on here..... fookin epic 

John

[kdw712]

So Kev that would make the Mongoose with the step down dropouts about the mk10, there were a few variants wer'n't there.  

bob not quite 

mk 1 had the flat style rear drops
mk 2 had the step down drops ( as per your frame)
mk 3 had no gussets
after that

who cares 

however in the mark one style there was a model called mongoose II  which was one of 4 standard models

• mongoose
• mongoose II
• mongoose motomag
• mongoose freemag          not wheel

[bobafett]

So Kev that would make the Mongoose with the step down dropouts about the mk10, there were a few variants wer'n't there.  

bob not quite 

mk 1 had the flat style rear drops
mk 2 had the step down drops ( as per your frame)
mk 3 had no gussets
after that

who cares 

however in the mark one style there was a model called mongoose II  which was one of 4 standard models

mongoose
mongoose II
mongoose motomag
mongoose freewheel

So Kev you agree then that the mongoose II and mongoose 2 are two different things ? 

i.e.

mongoose II = standard mongoose frame 1979-early 1981 but diiferent spec components (alloy wheels, freewheel, caliper brakes)
mongoose 2 = 1981 onwards - change in dropouts, serial style and decal style/position

? 

[kdw712]

john

yeap i do agree

there was what we call a mk 1 mongoose called the mongoose II its in the catalogues
as was the mongoose motomag

then the drops changed and we refer to those as mks two for easy id
mongoose didn't call them that

though the gusset less supergoose was called the supergoose III in some ad's

and then theres all those weird / odd ball ones as the styles changed and the parts bins played catch up

[bobafett]

then the drops changed and we refer to those as mks two for easy id
mongoose didn't call them that

Exactly "mongoose II" was a model name for a complete bike with a certain spec sold by mongoose but "mongoose 2" is a label that we as collectors give to the changed style of frame in the second half of 1981 onwards 


.......but 

Is it not dificult with those cross over frames to just put it down to the drop outs alone as the one item that says "right that's a mongoose 2" ? 

I look at Paul's (snav69) 1981 goose and my 1981 goose above, BOTH of them with July '81 serial numbers both with 2nd gen style serial numbers and both with second gen survivor decals and it's hard for me to just say "oh mines a mongoose 2 and paul's is a mongoose 1" as they could both possibly qualify as a "2" depending on the criteria you use 

Your thoughts mate ? 

[kdw712]

John your example is a good test

on first view I would have said mk1 & mk2 based on the drops alone
also the frame numbers prob help clearly identify the change over period
which is handy to know

once you go beyond that basic ID you get into the "mongoose mess"
and then Bob's comment about many the variants becomes true  (and we can't have bob being right ....  )

& to truly collect every goose you would need one of all these variants 

another question to ponder is why did they change the rear drops at all ?
pure cosmetics ?
or that and sales ie must have the latest bike ?
easier to build ?

[bobafett]

another question to ponder is why did they change the rear drops at all ?

Buggered if i'll be able to find it but I've read the answer to that - somewhere 

It was something like.... the 2nd gen or "super" dropout as it's often known was designed with the slot parrallel to the ground whereas the old mk1 style angles down - the old style would vary ride height / clearance (although only bloody marginaly !) depending on wheel position in the slot due to chain length etc. so the mk2 or super dropout negates this by being parrallel 

[bobafett]

I think it also helped with chain tension 

......and how sh!t was I at spelling parallel in that last post 

[kdw712]

 

get firefox and the built spell  chicker .....   


your explanation makes sense   ( dam how did he know that  )

super drop out ?
more info please

[bobafett]

super drop out ?
more info please

Dunno really Kev - not sure where I've got that term from TBH something I've obviously picked up on in one of the many many mongoose threads I've trawled through on various sites 

I'll have a little search around and see if I can refresh my memory 

 

[Glynnyboy]

Wow, to start with i wondered wtf you were on about john. Then your descriptive powers made it all clear. I like the term mongoose mess as someone used. Seems very apt.
Good read though cause i did end up understanding it in the end

[bobafett]

Wow, to start with i wondered wtf you were on about john. Then your descriptive powers made it all clear. I like the term mongoose mess as someone used. Seems very apt.
Good read though cause i did end up understanding it in the end

Clear as mud 

[kdw712]

Clear as mud 

shouldn't that be

as clear as Mongoose ?


    




i'll get me mongoose

i mean coat

[bobafett]

I just feel sorry for Paul (snav69) he only asked a seemingly simple question via PM and ends up with a 3 page thread 

So Paul to wrap the thread up - having read all this have you decided what bike you have there

The choices are.....

"mongoose"
"mongoose II"
"mongoose 2"

...and dare I say it "motomag" 

Maybe we should put it to the vote 

[snav69]

 
 

Thanks for all the hard work John 
I think i'll be calling mine a Mongoose II as advertised in the catalogue and if i was to sell the frame and forks alone i would probably call it a mongoose F&F off a mongoose II   
I have a headache now 

Cheers Fellas 

 

[bobafett]

No worries Paul - dead easy really, nothing to it 

[Graham Middleton]

Anyone want to resurrect this thread?