i looked at it for a good while before i put the thread up, what throws me is long or short nipples, i get the three and four cross bit i just want these wheels to look good and show of the hubs in a more open spoke configuration kind of way, if that makes sense, there is a shit load of info to take in there sean baffled me at times and i was sober when i went through it, very informative and put me in the right direction,