Hersden 2011 Series Dates

[TK The Mic]

The first full series on Hersden's new track kicks off on Sunday 3 April. Its the seventh series of racing  we are staging, and it looks like its going to be our biggest.
Sadly, due to dwindling numbers in 2010, Old Skool has been dropped this year.  You can still ride an Os bike but those doing so will race with 20" Masters. The dates for 2011 series are as follows

Sunday 3 April

Sunday 15 May

Sunday 5 June

Sunday 10 July

Sunday 7th August

Sunday 18 September

Series will be best 5 out of 6 rounds. Race entry fee is £5 for Masters and Cruisers. £3 for all others.

TK

[moomin]

This really saddens me, the Old School have been huge supporters of the club and committee for a long time and have helped financially in many ways.  The way finances are looking for us Hersden was looking like our only option this year but with the boys finding new interests and no Old School i think we'll probably bow out this year 

[58 delray]

we always had a full gate last year so i don't see why it has been dropped, we pay our way as far as i'm concerned 

[medved]

that's a shame, i was looking forward to coming down and riding old skool again.  seems like there is nowhere to race this class anymore

[jazzyje]

if enough turn up the class will be reinstated.we have always supported oldschool and they have been a massive part in what we do at hersden.but we cant run a series on 3/4 regular riders.the 17+ plus class was also poorly supported last year and it seems silly to run gates of 3 /4 for 2 different classes.you also have to accept that new riders on new bikes may be included in your class.like i say,if enough of you turn up you can have your own class.they dropped o/s from regional racing for the same reasons.we  give out medals at every race,massive cups and plates and concolation prizes at the end of the season.we charge the cheapest race fees anywhere and rarely charge for parking.we have at least £1000 to pay out before the regional this year.we run a tight budget and you get a lot for your money. the medals alone are £2 each.when there are only 3/4 of you you can see there is'nt much to put towards your end of season trophy (£16+plate£5).
   ps,parking is £2 this year.

[moomin]

Quote for Justin one of Hersdens organisers

if enough turn up the class will be reinstated.we have always supported oldschool and they have been a massive part in what we do at hersden.but we cant run a series on 3/4 regular riders.the 17+ plus class was also poorly supported last year and it seems silly to run gates of 3 /4 for 2 different classes.you also have to accept that new riders on new bikes may be included in your class.like i say,if enough of you turn up you can have your own class.they dropped o/s from regional racing for the same reasons.we  give out medals at every race,massive cups and plates and concolation prizes at the end of the season.we charge the cheapest race fees anywhere and rarely charge for parking.we have at least £1000 to pay out before the regional this year.we run a tight budget and you get a lot for your money. the medals alone are £2 each.when there are only 3/4 of you you can see there is'nt much to put towards your end of season trophy (£16+plate£5).
   ps,parking is £2 this year.
 [/i


As far as i can see the decision to not run old school is mainly because of the finances/turnout.  I've had a look at costs (although these cannot be 100% accurate as not all entries for each round are shown on the Hersden site)


In the 1st 3 rounds Old School entries per round and revenue to the club, are as below

Round 1 - 8 Riders - £40

Round 2 - 10 Riders £50

Round 3 - 12 Riders - £60

I cannot ascertain entries for for rounds 4 and 5 as the results only show top 5 finishers but the final round had 9 entries so add another £45 to the pot.

The cost of the Old School class to Hersden in relation to plates trophies and medals are as below

Medals - £36 for the series

Trophies £45 vfor the series

Plates £15 for the series.

Total £96.00

Taking into account cost versus revenue for the old school, not including rounds 4 and 5's incoming race fees the profit to the club is £118If you then compare this to other classes who only pay £3 entry their classes cost the club money to run!

The ladies class for example could net a maximum Revenue of £90 over the series versus a cost of 114.00!

The 14 and 16 class maximum potential revenue was £54.00 and the cost was £114.00.

On that basis i really am struggling to understand why the Old School class has been abolished.

The numbers you mention Justin of 3/4 per round last series confused me also. 

Round 1 = 8 entries

Round 2 - 10 Entries

Round 3 - 12 Entries

Round 6 - 9 Entries

As i say i cannot obtain figures for rounds 4 and 5 as they are only listed on Hersdens site as top 5 riders.

I presume that 17 + is masters, on that basis their entries were 6, 10 then 11 i think for the first 3 rounds.

I can honestly say that i really dont know quite what to make of the Old School being disbanded when it has been well supported and has paid for itslef  and as a class made the club money.  The only saving would be the cost of medals, trophies and plates as there is near on no way that the old schooler (billy O apart) will  be able to be competitive in a mixed masters class.  This would represent a maximum saving of £96.00!

I've got to say that we all came to Hersden purely to race the Old School.  We have every intention of being at Hersden and come round 1 if there is not a class for Tony to ride in then we simply wont come again as we could save money on petrol and do club races closer to home.  It would be interesting to see how many others may feel that way?

Just as an example, if just Tony, Emmanuel and Josh do not race Hersden this year the club will lose

£76 in entries and £12 in parking

If everyone in Old School made the same decision then the cost to Hersden as a club would be fairly substantiial.  Not just in entries and parking but burgers and coffee cos you know us Old schoolers dont do Pro Food 

I'm not in any way trying to be difficult but i cannot understand this decision with the reasons given even more so after all the support that the Old School have shown to the club by digging into their own pockets to pay for trophies..

I sincerely hope that the Old School put up as good a show of numbers in 2011 as they did in 2010 and we have an Old School Class

Also if i am out on figures Justin and someone can provide me with the exact numbers attending i will modify this post accordingly   
 
 
 

[58 delray]

it has now been confirmed by tk that an old school class will run at hersden, any new schooler that fancys ago will be welcome as i will be taking spare bikes for people to use 
note,  no new school bikes in old school 

[Humps00]

no new school bikes in old school 

Hope my '91 Redline isn't too "new school" for you Andy.  And if it is and I beat you  Just booked my guesthouse for the weekend of the first round so that's three Cruisers and a pensioner on an OS ride to be there.    And last places are MINE!!  Humps

[jazzyje]

it has been decided that oldschool will be reinstated for this year as it seems we have a renewed interest in the class.we reserve the right to put new riders on new bikes in that class as a taster.if a dad wants to have a go at racing to see if he likes it, he wont be made to feel unwelcome because of his choice of bike.it'll be hard enough for a new rider without riding a 25year old bike with a 18inch tt.he will however only be allowed 2 races before he has to either buy an oldschool bike or move class .
    look forward to seeing you all on the 3rd april.

[58 delray]

no new school bikes in old school 

Hope my '91 Redline isn't too "new school" for you Andy.  And if it is and I beat you  Just booked my guesthouse for the weekend of the first round so that's three Cruisers and a pensioner on an OS ride to be there.    And last places are MINE!!  Humps

your 91 redline is fine mate all we are saying is inch headset and caliper or pitbull brakes 

[58 delray]

it has been decided that oldschool will be reinstated for this year as it seems we have a renewed interest in the class.we reserve the right to put new riders on new bikes in that class as a taster.if a dad wants to have a go at racing to see if he likes it, he wont be made to feel unwelcome because of his choice of bike.it'll be hard enough for a new rider without riding a 25year old bike with a 18inch tt.he will however only be allowed 2 races before he has to either buy an oldschool bike or move class .
    look forward to seeing you all on the 3rd april.

the bikes i am offering to loan to any rider wishing to take part are not scetchy 18" tt bikes but 21" tt racers with good quality and in some cases nos parts on them, they are set up properly by myself (i worked in bike shops for many years and i'm also a qualified mechanical engineer)
this is not a renewed interest by the old schoolers but the same riders from last year wishing to continue to race in a class of our own, we managed to fill the new 8 man gate last year unlike some classes that didn't but have not been targeted.
seems to me that there is something else going on here?

[moomin]

it has been decided that oldschool will be reinstated for this year as it seems we have a renewed interest in the class.we reserve the right to put new riders on new bikes in that class as a taster.if a dad wants to have a go at racing to see if he likes it, he wont be made to feel unwelcome because of his choice of bike.it'll be hard enough for a new rider without riding a 25year old bike with a 18inch tt.he will however only be allowed 2 races before he has to either buy an oldschool bike or move class .
    look forward to seeing you all on the 3rd april.

Justin,

I have said in the other thread that this is not renewed interest, the class was well supported last year and raised a significant amount of funds for the club, i still dont understand why it was ever dropped, especially when there were other classes which cost the club money and consistently failed to fill even the 4 man gate!

With regards to new riders, as you well know the class will welcome anyone who wants to join in the fun, the bike that Andy has kindly agreed to lend out is not a 25 year old pile of crap with an 18" TT, it's a 21 " TT fully set up with NOS top end components that will more than likely be a far better ride than the dangerous Halfords shit he may bring along.  Putting someone on a New School bike is exactly the same as putting a 20" in a cruiser class or a MTB with gears and suspension into a cruiser class.  Completely unfair

I am aware of the situation that occurred at a meet last year where a rider on a Nu school bike was entered in the O/S.  As discussed with TK last night i have spoken to our boys who were involved and there was no bully boy tactics.  As far as i am aware the rider involved was not aware of the rules of the class or the fact that points would be affected.  He volunteered to step aside.  The fact that the guy has actually bought an OS bike to race goes to show just how welcoming we were and that he wants to race with a great group of guys again


It is not the first time that people have been pulled up, When my frame cracked Ratty agreed to let me ride on a new school bike, it ruffled feathers and i pulled back in racing so as not to upset people and then borrowed an old school bike after that.  The OS were not being unfair, they were asking me to play by the rules, as they have with others over the last few years.

The old school rules are very simple, 1" threaded headset and ccentrally mounted brake.  It's not hard to adhere to and i think Andy has been extremely generous to offer to lend a bike at that is worth in excess of £1000 to someone he doesn't even know.  But, thats the spirit of Old School and what makes it such great fun to be involved in.

As i have said previously the old school have rules for a reason and Hersden accepted those rules when they began running the class independantly.  The club have made some handsome profit over the years from the Old schoolers fees and generosity in funding trophies for the club.  To firstly abolish the class and then change the rules "because you can" is a complete lack of respect for the riders who at one point made up half of your clubs race meet.

I dont understand the hostility towards a group of people that have done nothing but help your club out.  The numbers in Old School may have dropped but your cruiser numbers have gone up, that'll be the ex Old Schoolers who decided to go New School, good on them but please dont penalise the people that would like to keep the Old School alive.

I hope that Hersden as a club can see the detriment that putting new school bikes into the class will have.  It makes the class farcicle and i dont think any of us are comfortable with being made to look like fools and let our class be belittled as a sidelione show when it has brought so much to the club.

I know that our riders see Hersden as the home of Old School, what has happened so far this year with the abolishment of the class and then restrictions set feels to me like being kicked out of the family  

I will PM you mine and Tony's number so that if you feel it would be beneficial then we can try and resolve this and put it to bed and look forward to another year of fantastic racing at Hersden  

[Deep Fried]

Anyway all that doesn't matter cos I'm back racing and I'm going to kick everyones arse. 

[Dark Diggler]

why so uptight y'all    if a class aint supported by riders it aint a class.

I love racing O/s but if I was regulary on a gate of 3 or 4, I would want a full gate, mixed with anyone, the 3 or 4 that are on os bikes would still get what they got before but with a full gate, better for them surely?. By the same token if 9 os riders turn up, I would expect the club concerned to do 2 gates, a 4 and a 5, like we had at Crewe last week.

OS racing is only as strong as the numbers of people racing , always has been, always will be, it doesnt have a custodian just lots of share holders who choose to race or not to race.

[moomin]

That is exactly the point, the class was well supported, if you look at my post earlier you will see that Old School had between 6 and 12 riders per round, where the 3/4 comes from i have no idea and thats why our feathers are ruffled.  Also we're being axed for being uneconomical but we pay £2 more to enter than 90% of the other classes!  We were a class that made some of the higher profits as a class when other classes ran with 3 or 4 riders which cost the club money to run and their class isn't axed

[jazzyje]

your not being axed now,you've been reinstated.the 3/4 riders comes from the people who competed in most rounds.the guy who finished 2nd was'nt even there to pick up his trophy.i have it in my shed.andy was the only rider to compete in all rounds and a few done 4,most done 2/3.when you look at it like that it was'nt a well supported series and  a few are moving on to cruiser and 20" this year.this is why we are putting newbies in this class.its always been a feeder class for older riders to get back into the sport.like me,like most that started back in 2006/7.
   one of the ideas behind what we originally said we would do, was to get the older riders classes full again.surely your not expecting us to axe 17+'senior ladies maybe a small class but the people that compete in that class race week in ,and week out at nationals and regionals.should we axe them and see their progression stop?
   of course the oldschool class has been very benificial to hersden over the years.without them our meetings would have been very boring.but on the other hand we have also done our bit at hersden to relaunch bmx racing in kent and supported oldschool when others have been less than welcoming.we were running meetings long before the oldschool revival and were still here now.
   i'm putting this one to bed.your reinstated,in hindsight i made a bad call and apoligise for any upset caused. and i hope to see a good turnout come 3rd april.the rules for newbies will be this.they will get 2 races on a new school bike should they wish to ride one.their points will be halved and they will have to decide on what class they wish to ride after 2 races.this will keep the series pure where the points are concerned and discourage glory hunters.i want new riders to get the bug,we need a class that can let them do this.our track is unique in that we offer a level that is accessable to everyone.we have other tracks that are radder,but we are all about progression,getting people started and getting the whole family racing.

[58 delray]

how about my offer that they ride a good quality, decent sized bike instead of a new school bike, as i have said i am willing to provide these at my own expense for people to use?

[moomin]

Awwwww we've been reinstated after years of support, THANKS

I've tried to be respectful in my replies, and factual as far as i can be.

FACT at least 4 rounds had more than enough riders to hold a class as i said i cant check the others the reports dont show true numbers.

FACT the class paid for itself

FACT the old school has more than paid it's dues to Hersden, (We were the ones who volunteered to pay extra race fees to help the club and when old schoolers moved to cruisers you put their fees up, nice cash cow we turned out to be) perhaps if someone had bothered to talk to Tony or any of the old school when this decision was initially discussed this whole thread might not have happened.

FACT i will not be bothering any more at Hersden.  I have helped personally, financially, raced, spectated and done your moto sheets and finish line and this fiasco is a croc of shit.

FACT I spoke to TK last night who agreed the class had more than enough support and had paid  for itself so exactly what has motivated this decision?  Last years incident, that was an adult discussion? are BCF telling you we cant have Old School now you're a regional club or do you just have beef with someon in partcular?

I offered Tony all the Old Schools help for the regional, i even offered to do the lunches and bloody serve them to help the club out!

As for the 2nd place rider not coming to collect his trophy, have you ever thought that sometimes people have personal things to attend to, it is 5 out of 6 after all!?  we turned up at a round last year after Tones daughter had miscarried, his ex wife was then rushed to hospital, although we had registered by phone at the next race i paid the fees for all of us even though we hadent raced and withdrew before sheets were posted.

Please dont disrespect the people that have supported the club.  I'm glad the old school has a class and i hope they enjoy racing new schoolers.

Tony as always has my support if he wants to go.

Good Luck

[58 delray]

oh the 2nd placed rider did collect his trophy on the day because it was me and it is sitting on my sideboard 

[spike371]

oh the 2nd placed rider did collect his trophy on the day because it was me and it is sitting on my sideboard 

I guess Justin means me for 3rd place 

Wanted to be there for the last race, just happened to be on a holiday that had been booked before all the fixture swaps 

[58 delray]

oh the 2nd placed rider did collect his trophy on the day because it was me and it is sitting on my sideboard 

I guess Justin means me for 3rd place 

Wanted to be there for the last race, just happened to be on a holiday that had been booked before all the fixture swaps 

yeah i know mate but you didn't turn up you naughty boy,  do you still want the GT stickers by the way ?

[spike371]

oh the 2nd placed rider did collect his trophy on the day because it was me and it is sitting on my sideboard 

I guess Justin means me for 3rd place 

Wanted to be there for the last race, just happened to be on a holiday that had been booked before all the fixture swaps 

yeah i know mate but you didn't turn up you naughty boy,  do you still want the GT stickers by the way ?

Yes please bud